Sky007FR
03/11/2009, 23h58
'lut !
Je viens de commander ce petit mod pour le G25 :
http://www.apelectrix.com/images/IMGP0177_0.jpg
The G25 load sensor modification is designed to replace the potentiometer and spring mechanism in the Logitech pedal assembly. When used in the brake position, it allows a more realistic action of braking by offering mechanical resistance similar to the amount found on a real car.
The stock G25 pedal assembly uses a potentiometer to measure the amount of braking the user inputs. This means that the pedal must travel a certain distance with little mechanical resistance to a point the user feels proper maximum braking is achieved. This method is unrealistic and difficult to do with repeated accuracy.
The modification offered here uses a special load sensor integrated with a mechanical actuator that is specially designed to fit into the assembly without any further difficult modification by the user.
C'est un load-cell qui s'adapte sur le G25 et le G27.
A priori le montage est facile et ne nécessite pas de souder quoi que ce soit.
Le prix n'est pas très élevé : 72$ frais de port inclus soit 51€ avec le cours du $ actuel... A comparer avec le prix d'un pedalier complet avec load cell.
Je vous tiens au jus dès que je le reçois (faut compter au minimum 2/3 semaines).
D'après les retours de ceux qui ont commandé, ça a l'air d'être tip-top !
Quelques avis :
Ok ive had a few hours with it now so ill give as little review. I have it running with the bodnar box btw.
I had high expectations for this thing as ive been craving a load cell braking system for years, .and Im happy to report its pretty much met my expectations. Ive lost count of the things ive jammed behind my brake pedal over the years. Sponges, squash balls, cardboard, custom springs, rubber, you name it. Well no need for that anymore.
Andy has really nailed the pedal feel, as it is very stiff, yet has a small (less than 1 cm) level of sprung travel, much like a real car pedal. Its a massive improvement in feel over the standard G25 pedal, which makes driving more enjoyable, which is alone worth the money.
In terms of performance. Im still getting used to it but braking is definately easier, and it will definately make my driving more consistent as ive always struggled with braking sensitivity in iracing. Im not sure if my peak lap lap with improve as I have not done enough laps but consistency will and that is a speed increase in its own way.
I did some laps in the corvette this morning, my first laps in the car, and the braking felt pretty nice considering im still learning the car and new brakes. Lock ups are not a major problem, but the key is calibration. When you calibrate make sure to press the pedal unrealistically hard so it will be EXTREMELY hard or maybe impossible to get to 100% braking force ingame, because you dont need it. In a real car you never really get to that level anyway. With the leo's program i have max braking at 700 range, and under normal hard brake applications Im only getting to 640, so this helps with the brake lock ups a lot.When I first hit the brakes I can use 100% if i really try and then it quickly drops off to more moderate levels as I slow down.
My ir brake linearity setting is 0.65. I just did it manually to ease up the initial braking a bit and it seems fine. If you use the measurment thing it gives a reading of 3.5 which is too high imo. The more movement the pedal has the higher the number, I assume andys load cell has more movement than most others? Im not sure but surely CST pedals also have a bit of throw as well?
Only small issue i have is brake slightly sticking and not returning to 0. On quick release its about 25 and on slow 45. It could be just a stiffness because its new but no big deal as I just made the minimum range 50 to cover it.
All in all Im extremely happy with my brake pedal for the first time ever. For the cheap price I think this really is a must buy for any g25. (along with bodnar box). For a bit over $100 you can get your G25 pedals to comparable performance to any high end pedal set.
:D :D :D ......more on that later! (any word on whether we can shorten that rubber just a little to gain just a bit more travel?)
I can finally drive with shoes on (what I always wanted) using this mod and the shuffling of the stock springs around. My pedals are setup as follows...
Attatched to an MDF pedal box and inverted so that the pedal spacing and positioning will mimic my RX-7 as close as I can get it.
original Clutch spring ----> Throttle
original Brake spring ---> Clutch
The brake pedal itself is mounted further from the base by roughly 18mm, and then that assembly is mounted roughly 25mm higher up the board than the throttle pedal to provide a far better ability to heel and toe in the cars that need it. However depending on whether or not I get word that I can OR cannot shorten the rubber bit to gain a little more travel I will have to reposition the brake pedal.
Currently in the position I have the pedals, the brake moves MAYBE 6-7mm (.25ish inches) so it is now impractical to heel and toe until moving the pedals around again. Either way I would like to change the travel by roughly another 12-18mm or so to mimic the real cars pedal travel which is very important to me. :)
Regardless of whether or not I can add travel, this mod is ABSOLUTE THE GREATEST THING I'VE EVER DONE FOR SIM DRIVING. Sorry for the caps, but I want to get the point across that this mod along with Leo's box should be written in the requirements section.
Stunning to put it lightly. Now then...anyone that knows can I gain a little more travel shortening the rubber w/o damaging the the assembly. (which would have me buy another anyway w/o hesitation...it's THAT good).
LKL
I have now installed my load sensor, which took about an hour to complete, with me being careful and not rushing things. The process went smoothly with no problems, other than a little difficulty getting the screws out of the top pivot bushing. But I was able to get the second one out, finally. After that, it was a breeze.
The instructions are at apelectrix.com, BTW. There was no mention of that in the package - the only thing in it was the sensor, but the instructions on the web site are very good. You will need needle-nose pliers, a fairly small-tipped phillips screwdriver, a 10mm conventional wrench, a 5mm Allen wrench, and another, very small Allen wrench. I would guess it's 1.5 - 2.0mm. Unfortunately, mine isn't marked (not uncommon with Allen wrenches, especially little tiny ones), so I'm not sure, but it's definitely metric, of course. Most parts-store metric Allen wrench sets will include this size, in my experience. If you don't have the tools, get them, it's worth it.
Having done the install, I hooked-up my pedals and calibrated them, which went smoothly in iRacing. I'm using a Bodnar box, also. In the beginning, I set the Brake Force Curve Factor to 0. But, just as with the stock Logitech brakes, even with the Bodnar box, I found that to be too sensitive during initial engagement. So I started raising the value until I was happy (I don't bother with the "Measurement" routine in iRacing, I just set the value manually). In the end, I set at 5, just like before (call me crazy if you want to). That might change in the future, but I doubt I would ever go below 4.
When I pushed the brake pedal by hand on the workbench, it seemed surprisingly soft and there was definitely a bit of travel, and I was concerned that it wouldn't be firm enough to suit me. However, once I began to use it, that went away. It feels right under my foot, bench tests not withstanding. In fact, at first, it felt so tight I wasn't sure I would like it. But adjusting the BFCF, along with a few laps of familiarization, made that go away, too. Now, there are no issues, only bliss. I am in love . . .
I have been driving sims, since there were sims to drive. We finally got widely available wheel / pedal / shifter setups right around 1990, from Thrustmaster (I had a T2). And for almost twenty years since then, I have had to rapidly translate my braking intentions into a very precise and consistent foot position. I accepted that like most everyone else, because it was better than nothing. But my racing buddies and I discussed the possibility of load-cell sim brakes a dozen years ago. Load cells were expensive and availability was limited back then and, well, I just never did anything about it. I was happy enough with my old-school rig. So I waited until tonight to have a proper sim brake pedal. And that was stupid, because a load-sensing sim brake pedal is the best thing since naked women.
A conventional, position-sensing sim brake works . . . reasonably well - with a lot of practice. And provided you can devote a sizable chunk of your mental focus to using it. And assuming you don't need to make very rapid and precise adjustments to braking force. And if conditions are exactly the same as what you practiced under. But on cold tires, or under pressure from behind, or when you're trying to out-brake someone on the inside, or just when you're on the raggedy edge, a position-sensing brake is a PITA.
The load sensor puts everything right. I got down to my PBs in a handful of laps, and was able to do them consistently. Former trouble spots don't trouble me, anymore. My transitions on-and-off the brakes are smoother and more precise. It will definitely be worth some lap time, as I learn to exploit it more fully, but (like with FFB) the main advantage is consistency. And of course, there is the immersion factor - finally, a proper brake pedal! I don't care if it's faster or not, it just feels better. Recommended.
Un sujet parlant de ce fameux mod sur le forum iRacing :
http://members.iracing.com/iforum/thread.jspa?threadID=28939&start=0&tstart=0
Le site officiel : http://www.apelectrix.com/index.html
Je viens de commander ce petit mod pour le G25 :
http://www.apelectrix.com/images/IMGP0177_0.jpg
The G25 load sensor modification is designed to replace the potentiometer and spring mechanism in the Logitech pedal assembly. When used in the brake position, it allows a more realistic action of braking by offering mechanical resistance similar to the amount found on a real car.
The stock G25 pedal assembly uses a potentiometer to measure the amount of braking the user inputs. This means that the pedal must travel a certain distance with little mechanical resistance to a point the user feels proper maximum braking is achieved. This method is unrealistic and difficult to do with repeated accuracy.
The modification offered here uses a special load sensor integrated with a mechanical actuator that is specially designed to fit into the assembly without any further difficult modification by the user.
C'est un load-cell qui s'adapte sur le G25 et le G27.
A priori le montage est facile et ne nécessite pas de souder quoi que ce soit.
Le prix n'est pas très élevé : 72$ frais de port inclus soit 51€ avec le cours du $ actuel... A comparer avec le prix d'un pedalier complet avec load cell.
Je vous tiens au jus dès que je le reçois (faut compter au minimum 2/3 semaines).
D'après les retours de ceux qui ont commandé, ça a l'air d'être tip-top !
Quelques avis :
Ok ive had a few hours with it now so ill give as little review. I have it running with the bodnar box btw.
I had high expectations for this thing as ive been craving a load cell braking system for years, .and Im happy to report its pretty much met my expectations. Ive lost count of the things ive jammed behind my brake pedal over the years. Sponges, squash balls, cardboard, custom springs, rubber, you name it. Well no need for that anymore.
Andy has really nailed the pedal feel, as it is very stiff, yet has a small (less than 1 cm) level of sprung travel, much like a real car pedal. Its a massive improvement in feel over the standard G25 pedal, which makes driving more enjoyable, which is alone worth the money.
In terms of performance. Im still getting used to it but braking is definately easier, and it will definately make my driving more consistent as ive always struggled with braking sensitivity in iracing. Im not sure if my peak lap lap with improve as I have not done enough laps but consistency will and that is a speed increase in its own way.
I did some laps in the corvette this morning, my first laps in the car, and the braking felt pretty nice considering im still learning the car and new brakes. Lock ups are not a major problem, but the key is calibration. When you calibrate make sure to press the pedal unrealistically hard so it will be EXTREMELY hard or maybe impossible to get to 100% braking force ingame, because you dont need it. In a real car you never really get to that level anyway. With the leo's program i have max braking at 700 range, and under normal hard brake applications Im only getting to 640, so this helps with the brake lock ups a lot.When I first hit the brakes I can use 100% if i really try and then it quickly drops off to more moderate levels as I slow down.
My ir brake linearity setting is 0.65. I just did it manually to ease up the initial braking a bit and it seems fine. If you use the measurment thing it gives a reading of 3.5 which is too high imo. The more movement the pedal has the higher the number, I assume andys load cell has more movement than most others? Im not sure but surely CST pedals also have a bit of throw as well?
Only small issue i have is brake slightly sticking and not returning to 0. On quick release its about 25 and on slow 45. It could be just a stiffness because its new but no big deal as I just made the minimum range 50 to cover it.
All in all Im extremely happy with my brake pedal for the first time ever. For the cheap price I think this really is a must buy for any g25. (along with bodnar box). For a bit over $100 you can get your G25 pedals to comparable performance to any high end pedal set.
:D :D :D ......more on that later! (any word on whether we can shorten that rubber just a little to gain just a bit more travel?)
I can finally drive with shoes on (what I always wanted) using this mod and the shuffling of the stock springs around. My pedals are setup as follows...
Attatched to an MDF pedal box and inverted so that the pedal spacing and positioning will mimic my RX-7 as close as I can get it.
original Clutch spring ----> Throttle
original Brake spring ---> Clutch
The brake pedal itself is mounted further from the base by roughly 18mm, and then that assembly is mounted roughly 25mm higher up the board than the throttle pedal to provide a far better ability to heel and toe in the cars that need it. However depending on whether or not I get word that I can OR cannot shorten the rubber bit to gain a little more travel I will have to reposition the brake pedal.
Currently in the position I have the pedals, the brake moves MAYBE 6-7mm (.25ish inches) so it is now impractical to heel and toe until moving the pedals around again. Either way I would like to change the travel by roughly another 12-18mm or so to mimic the real cars pedal travel which is very important to me. :)
Regardless of whether or not I can add travel, this mod is ABSOLUTE THE GREATEST THING I'VE EVER DONE FOR SIM DRIVING. Sorry for the caps, but I want to get the point across that this mod along with Leo's box should be written in the requirements section.
Stunning to put it lightly. Now then...anyone that knows can I gain a little more travel shortening the rubber w/o damaging the the assembly. (which would have me buy another anyway w/o hesitation...it's THAT good).
LKL
I have now installed my load sensor, which took about an hour to complete, with me being careful and not rushing things. The process went smoothly with no problems, other than a little difficulty getting the screws out of the top pivot bushing. But I was able to get the second one out, finally. After that, it was a breeze.
The instructions are at apelectrix.com, BTW. There was no mention of that in the package - the only thing in it was the sensor, but the instructions on the web site are very good. You will need needle-nose pliers, a fairly small-tipped phillips screwdriver, a 10mm conventional wrench, a 5mm Allen wrench, and another, very small Allen wrench. I would guess it's 1.5 - 2.0mm. Unfortunately, mine isn't marked (not uncommon with Allen wrenches, especially little tiny ones), so I'm not sure, but it's definitely metric, of course. Most parts-store metric Allen wrench sets will include this size, in my experience. If you don't have the tools, get them, it's worth it.
Having done the install, I hooked-up my pedals and calibrated them, which went smoothly in iRacing. I'm using a Bodnar box, also. In the beginning, I set the Brake Force Curve Factor to 0. But, just as with the stock Logitech brakes, even with the Bodnar box, I found that to be too sensitive during initial engagement. So I started raising the value until I was happy (I don't bother with the "Measurement" routine in iRacing, I just set the value manually). In the end, I set at 5, just like before (call me crazy if you want to). That might change in the future, but I doubt I would ever go below 4.
When I pushed the brake pedal by hand on the workbench, it seemed surprisingly soft and there was definitely a bit of travel, and I was concerned that it wouldn't be firm enough to suit me. However, once I began to use it, that went away. It feels right under my foot, bench tests not withstanding. In fact, at first, it felt so tight I wasn't sure I would like it. But adjusting the BFCF, along with a few laps of familiarization, made that go away, too. Now, there are no issues, only bliss. I am in love . . .
I have been driving sims, since there were sims to drive. We finally got widely available wheel / pedal / shifter setups right around 1990, from Thrustmaster (I had a T2). And for almost twenty years since then, I have had to rapidly translate my braking intentions into a very precise and consistent foot position. I accepted that like most everyone else, because it was better than nothing. But my racing buddies and I discussed the possibility of load-cell sim brakes a dozen years ago. Load cells were expensive and availability was limited back then and, well, I just never did anything about it. I was happy enough with my old-school rig. So I waited until tonight to have a proper sim brake pedal. And that was stupid, because a load-sensing sim brake pedal is the best thing since naked women.
A conventional, position-sensing sim brake works . . . reasonably well - with a lot of practice. And provided you can devote a sizable chunk of your mental focus to using it. And assuming you don't need to make very rapid and precise adjustments to braking force. And if conditions are exactly the same as what you practiced under. But on cold tires, or under pressure from behind, or when you're trying to out-brake someone on the inside, or just when you're on the raggedy edge, a position-sensing brake is a PITA.
The load sensor puts everything right. I got down to my PBs in a handful of laps, and was able to do them consistently. Former trouble spots don't trouble me, anymore. My transitions on-and-off the brakes are smoother and more precise. It will definitely be worth some lap time, as I learn to exploit it more fully, but (like with FFB) the main advantage is consistency. And of course, there is the immersion factor - finally, a proper brake pedal! I don't care if it's faster or not, it just feels better. Recommended.
Un sujet parlant de ce fameux mod sur le forum iRacing :
http://members.iracing.com/iforum/thread.jspa?threadID=28939&start=0&tstart=0
Le site officiel : http://www.apelectrix.com/index.html